COPS and M16's

[ggross]

Are cops allowed to have about 20-30 people and carry M16's to deliver an eviction notice when there is no sign of any form of eminent threat to their lives or safety.
This is something that is going on and its a serious injustice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enanR8vZc0M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDmxS0TROt8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvohCHMva5Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExD_oazOQhM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48fawW3O3FQ

The first video is from camera one and so is the second
The third and fourth are from camera 2 and the fifth is from a few days ago. Please look at these, the bank is forclosing on the house and kicking them out they gave an eviction notice today but they have a land patent. If you would like to know what a land patent is please ask me. If you would like to know more as well ask me, I will be happy to tell you.

[DELTREE]

If I was a policeofficer I would have a M60 the hel* with that 16.
If it is me or you;It got to be you!
You have to pay or GO! Just like a car, if you owe and don't pay the REPO man will get it back to the bank!!
That's LIFE!!!!

[ggross]

did that 11 year old just try to tell me off? Ok look first off they DONT OWE ANYTHING THEY OWN THE ****ING LAND second off thats my friends your talking about so I would appreciate if you showed a little bit of respect, I posted this thread not you, third off, the police around here are so corrupt, its sickening, fourth, its amazing as to how many americans dont even realize that their constitutional RIGHTS are being VIOLATED every single day, do soem research son.
Me or you mentality doesnt apply here, these people have not threatened the cops in any form or fashion, never have they shown signs of violence, NEVER.
And my last statement, an M16 is an assualt rifle ASSUALT Why would they need assualt rifles to drop off a small piece of paper.

[DELTREE]

he bank is forclosing on the house and kicking them out they gave an eviction notice today. QUESTION???? How can the bank forclose on the land if they don't owe it any money??!! Some thing is not right here????

[ggross]

ok the bank is ignoring their land patent, a land patent fully authorized (which is what they have) holds more power than a state constitution, so you cant tell me that some local bank has more power than a land patent.

[ggross]

Though it’s true, "Land, protected by Land Patent, can’t lawfully be seized for debt or taxes."
RESOURCE
http://www.teamlaw.org/LandPatents.htm

[DELTREE]

I have heard this before.If you own the land out right, I don't see the problem.
But if you don't own the land, and owe the bank; that is the problem. This TRICK has been used by many people, it has just caused them BIG problems.
YOU HAVE TO PAY OFF THE PERSON THAT HAS THE DEED TO THE LAND FIRST!

[ggross]

They Have The Deed To The Land

[Murray S.]

They Have The Deed To The Land

Howdy:

But, did they use that deed as collatoral on a loan they failed to repay??

If so, they forfeited their deed to the land to the bank..

Willing to bet YOU don't know all the story !!!

Murray

[renegade600]

did that 11 year old just try to tell me off? Ok look first off they DONT OWE ANYTHING THEY OWN THE ****ING LAND second off thats my friends your talking about so I would appreciate if you showed a little bit of respect, I posted this thread not you, third off, the police around here are so corrupt, its sickening, fourth, its amazing as to how many americans dont even realize that their constitutional RIGHTS are being VIOLATED every single day, do soem research son.
Me or you mentality doesnt apply here, these people have not threatened the cops in any form or fashion, never have they shown signs of violence, NEVER.
And my last statement, an M16 is an assualt rifle ASSUALT Why would they need assualt rifles to drop off a small piece of paper.

yes you were and I agree with the 11 year old. There is alot to the story that what you see. How do you know they dont owe anything??? How do you know there were not leins placed against the property? How do you know the land was not use as collatoral? How do you know the land was not forfeited through some court action or forfeiture because of illegal activity. How do you know the videos are even real and not some scripted as with most youtube trash? How do you know???

I own this bridge in brooklyn thats for sale real cheap. I will even give you a discount.

[Snurfen]

I think perhaps ggross was responding to the *ahem* well balanced and thoughtful discussion in the statement "If it is me or you;It got to be you!".

regardless of the pros or cons of this case, inflammatory responses like that suggest a limited grasp of debating skills.

My two pence: it does seem a little over the top for an eviction.

[ggross]

0.0

[lufbra]

So take it up with a local lawyer or politician, rather post in a forum where nobody can help!!

[ggross]

yeah....we got this all, im just spreading it around, these people are corrupt, we have Erin Brokavich helping as well, gonna see the governer today, and Tony Robbins is helping as well, got a lot of powerful connections helping out now. Oh and the bank forclosed because Mr. Clum sued the bank for fraud, I am not even sure if he has had that trial yet but once they found out he was sueing they started the forclosure. (sorry about yesterday lost my cool after they came down the property with an assault rifle (the assault rifle was designed with one purpose in mind) just to deliver a peice of paper.) But yeah, lotta packing to do, got a 1.5 million dollar house full of stuff that needs to be packed.*I think thats why dont quote me on it im a lil lost in it all*

[DELTREE]

"If it is me or you;It got to be you!".inflammatory responses like that.
The only point I am making is; If I was a police officer: I want all the FIRE POWER I can get. It is to late when you are dead! MY Friend:State of Equilibrium

[Snurfen]

Good thing you ain't then! http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v405/snurfen/ef5597c2.gif

[ggross]

"If it is me or you;It got to be you!".inflammatory responses like that.
The only point I am making is; If I was a police officer: I want all the FIRE POWER I can get. It is to late when you are dead! MY Friend:State of Equilibrium

yea but they KNEW there is no threat with these people, they brought the gun as a sure sign of intimidation, and those are words that came straight from Erin Brokavich's mouth.

[ggross]

*****************UPDATE******************
ight, so yeah, heres a lil update, we got all the stuff packed and waited for 1 on thursday for them to come, and come they did. 2 Helicopters hovered the area, about 30 cop cars SUV's under cover units and the S.W.A.T team showed up. They said "Walk off the property anyone who ran would be shot." They stole two cameras that were being used to film what was happening. Now explain to me, why the hell did they need ALL of that, just to ask the family to leave the property, they just wanted to be there to see them take the house, and it wasnt even the whole family, it was the father and 2 daughters. Why did they need all that? I dont know. Sounds like a waste of money and resources to me.

[renegade600]

*****************UPDATE******************
ight, so yeah, heres a lil update, we got all the stuff packed and waited for 1 on thursday for them to come, and come they did. 2 Helicopters hovered the area, about 30 cop cars SUV's under cover units and the S.W.A.T team showed up. They said "Walk off the property anyone who ran would be shot." They stole two cameras that were being used to film what was happening. Now explain to me, why the hell did they need ALL of that, just to ask the family to leave the property, they just wanted to be there to see them take the house, and it wasnt even the whole family, it was the father and 2 daughters. Why did they need all that? I dont know. Sounds like a waste of money and resources to me.


well, IMO, if everyones attitude there was like your in this thread, then they did not have enough firepower. :rotflmao:

[DELTREE]

It is hard to make out what is going on??
How can they run you off your land? where they not paying their bills?
Something is missing here?? could you pease tell us what it is.
Your Friend DELTREE

[ggross]

well, IMO, if everyones attitude there was like your in this thread, then they did not have enough firepower. :rotflmao: So you think it was ABOSULTELY necessary to bring 20+ cop cars A swat team and two helicopters to get 3 people off a piece of land. And I wondered why this country was so messed up today, now I have my answer. They paid all there bills, they were going to sue the bank and once the bank found out they started foreclosure immediately.

[uripyores]

"started foreclosure"
I didn't know they could do that if all the bills were being paid. :hmm:

[DELTREE]

There is something MISSING here?
ggross has the answer, but he/she will not tell us or does not know????
My question is? as been put forth: how can you foreclose, if you have the deed and paid your bills? and what would the bank have to do with it??? it they didn't hold the deed????

[ggross]

"started foreclosure"
I didn't know they could do that if all the bills were being paid. :hmm:
They cant thats the whole point, the Clums still have a loan on the bank but not for the house or the land, thats all paid off but they called in the loan that the clums have, I thought this had all been made clear and please will someone go google land patent, its not that hard, There is no way that the bank can foreclose on the house even though they did, and had the backing of the local sherrifs department, thats where things got screwed up, but its ok cause the firing process has begun and I believe its 3 sheriffs have been fired now, all thanks to Erin Brockavich and Tony Robbins. And I believe that one of the judges is about to be fired as well for paying off the lady who takes all the notes during the hearing, well she was reported to have been there at 8:30 but she was not present during the trial. kinda fishy.

[ggross]

There is something MISSING here?
ggross has the answer, but he/she will not tell us or does not know????
My question is? as been put forth: how can you foreclose, if you have the deed and paid your bills? and what would the bank have to do with it??? it they didn't hold the deed????
You cant, BB&T is doing an illegal foreclosure, thats the whole point of what I am posting here, its not a hard concept to grasp. His record is clean and his credit is great. I could not be 100% sure on him having the deed to his house, I am pretty sure he does so you can not quote me on that, but he has kept up with all of his payments, he is behind on NOTHING. He was going to sue BB&T and once they found out that a lawsuite was being filed they immediatly started an illegal foreclosure, my guess would be that they wanted to scare them out of the lawsuit. I am not sure, hopefully I will be able to get in touch with Erin Brockavich soon and she may come on here and explain this in MUCH greater detail as far as the legality of things goes. I couldnt be 100% sure on that either seeing as she is very busy. And a second update goes to show you that they just purchased a house in Tennessee so that shows you that they arent broke or behind on bills and the only time that the bank will usually foreclose on a house due to lack of bills or payments is when a family has declared bankruptcy, I would know my family had to declare bankruptcy and the bank didnt even show interest in foreclosing on our house until about 8-10 months after we declared bankruptcy and that was with about 15000 in bills that were due and about 8 house payments that we had not been able to pay nor were we able to make payments on the van for about 4 months, and this is all through the same bank, so why would the same bank be so leniant with us on such a huge debt but immediately start foreclosure on this family when they are in no debt. I dunno you can think what you want I will tell you right now that I am probably one of the worst people at explaining things of this nature.

[Snurfen]

Hahahahahahahaha - I hope they sent a SWAT squad and forty overarmed goons into the Sherrifs office and the homes of those at fault to fire them.

As my grandad and dad taught me, ALWAYS obey the law when it is being dealt out fairly, but don't let those in power bully you.

Hahahahahahahahahaha.

GG, I'm glad your friends are getting justice to serve them at last. Wish them a Merry Christmas from me.

[justM3]

Though it’s true, "Land, protected by Land Patent, can’t lawfully be seized for debt or taxes."
RESOURCE
http://www.teamlaw.org/LandPatents.htmNice source you present for legal proof, A group that supports non-payment of taxes, says that the US goverment is not the legal goverment and thinks only those that own land should be able to vote.

The bank could not forclose on the property if there was a loan secured by it and if as you say the clum's have cash, why don't they pay what they owe.

what the deal with the father putting his daughters into these situations. Why would he have his daughters of all people there on the day of the eviction.

[ggross]

Nice source you present for legal proof, A group that supports non-payment of taxes, says that the US goverment is not the legal goverment and thinks only those that own land should be able to vote.

The bank could not forclose on the property if there was a loan secured by it and if as you say the clum's have cash, why don't they pay what they owe.

what the deal with the father putting his daughters into these situations. Why would he have his daughters of all people there on the day of the eviction.
His daughters chose to stay and they didnt owe anything, that has been clearly stated many times please go back and read the other posts. And thank you snurfen.

[justM3]

Come on. You can see him encouraging his girls to get in there on the youTube video. If it was my kids, I'd keep them out of the mess as much as possible. 12 and 14 year olds don't need to deal with that kind of cr*p.

So, if they don't owe money what grounds did the bank use to seize the property? I'm not buying that the bank just decided they liked the property and said its ours out of the blue.

[Amiduffer]

What a mess. Associating with wacko militia anti-government scammers and getting his family involved. What a schmuck.

Well GGross, considering what happened at Waco, and the attempted assassination of Lyndon LaRouche back in '86, you got off lucky.

Of course, please realize, with the collapse of the housing bubble, whats happening to you is now happening on a mass scale all over the country. We're looking at roughly 2 million people being evicted because of the sub-prime mortgage scams that were pushed on the the black and hispanic communities.

[Vercades]

"No State shall... make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts"

That's throws out the idea the debt was payed by a deed.

Wow, they sent the police home when they(police) tryed to issue a court order by a Judge that doesn't have jurisdiction in the regional area. That same Judge illegally held David Clum in contempt and, incarcerated him. This is an amazing story.

[z1p]

"No State shall... make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts"

That's throws out the idea the debt was payed by a deed.

Wow, they sent the police home when they(police) tryed to issue a court order by a Judge that doesn't have jurisdiction in the regional area. That same Judge illegally held David Clum in contempt and, incarcerated him. This is an amazing story.
I believe the judge does have jurisdiction, its just that they are saying that the US and state governments and the judges appointed by them are not legal. Have you take a look through teamlaw?

[Vercades]

The judge that signed court order and sent David to jail didn't prove to the court he was a constitutional judge and, proves that he doesn't have jurisdiction in the area. That's the last bit of what went on after that I don't know what happened.

Our Sherrif in my county was arrested for theft not to long ago of illegally confiscating things.

[Snurfen]

Blimey, your legal system per State and Federaly seems massively complicated - but I suppose that's how lawyers make such a good living.

[Vercades]

Blimey, your legal system per State and Federaly seems massively complicated - but I suppose that's how lawyers make such a good living.
Well it's all about being qualified, the way I see it.

[z1p]

...didn't prove to the court he was a constitutional judge ... Pardon my ignorance here... What's a 'constitutional judge' and to what court did he have to prove he was a judge?

[Vercades]

Just a judge that knows the constitutional rights of both parties involved in a court of law. I don't know why he had to prove himself but, I'm sure alot of judges have to go through the same process.

[Miz]

There are two judicial systems in the U.S.: State and Federal

Federal judges are all appointed and they are appointed by the President of the U.S. They are appointed for life.

State judges may be elected or may be appointed by that state's governor, depending on that state's constitution.

The qualifications of a federal judge are determined by the one doing the appointing. Of course, the president himself doesn't do the research. There is a staff to compile resumes of nominees and the president makes his selection from the information and recommendations the staff submits to him.

The governors of the states have the same process of staff/resumes/recommendations if their state's judges are appointed.

In states where judges are elected, the candidates must meet the requirements as written in that state's constitution. Those who qualify run for a state judgeship office just like any other political candidate.

So when talking about "constitutional judges," I guess which constitution is the relevant point. ;)

[Snurfen]

Thanks Miz, makes a bit more sense now. Presumably there is a minimum qualification level (e.g. certified lawyer or such).

[Miz]

I suppose Congress may have passed something governing what a potential federal judge has to have in the way of credentials but the U.S. Constitution only says they are appointed for life as long as they display "good behavior" and that they get paid on a regular basis.

So, it's completely up to the president. As anyone who wasn't in a coma and lived in the U.S. the last few years knows, Congress has to confirm the appointments. It's that confirmation process that probably keeps Congress from opening a huge can of worms by trying to pass laws to control judicial branch appointments. Well, that and the Constitution's balance of power provisions.

In Kansas, state judges are elected and I think...but I'm not sure...they have to have a law degree.

We also have magistrate judges, one per county. They're elected. They only have to be at least 21 years old, residents of the county and citizens of the U.S. Magistrate judges don't hear major felony or capital crime cases. They're the ones who get to her "child in need of care," some divorces, small claims court, traffic violations, stuff like that. They're the ones who have the most contact with the average citizen. Fortunately, since they're not lawyers, they tend to hand out commonsense decisions a lot more often. ;)

[ggross]

What a mess. Associating with wacko militia anti-government scammers and getting his family involved. What a schmuck.

Well GGross, considering what happened at Waco, and the attempted assassination of Lyndon LaRouche back in '86, you got off lucky.

Of course, please realize, with the collapse of the housing bubble, whats happening to you is now happening on a mass scale all over the country. We're looking at roughly 2 million people being evicted because of the sub-prime mortgage scams that were pushed on the the black and hispanic communities.
wow, I am doing research on all of this, could you infer on what the mortgage scams were

[DELTREE]

ggross, I hope the NEW YEAR is a lot better for you and your's; and hope this Christmas was a good one.
Take Care and GOD BLESS
Your Friend DELTREE

[z1p]

I'm still dense (or at least a disbeliever), but how can can a presiding judge elected by the states general assembly not be a valid judge?

[oracle128]

We also have magistrate judges, one per county.Just "Magistrates". They're not judges.

[z1p]

Just "Magistrates". They're not judges.

But, in this case its a presiding circuit judge they are questioning. It seems he that he would have to have been elected to his position according to the rules set forth by the state.

[Miz]

Just "Magistrates". They're not judges.

They may be called "just magistrates" in Australia but in Kansas, they're called, and have the official title of "Magistrate Judge." Their full title is "District Magistrate Judge" since Kansas is divided into judicial districts.

What's true in one country is not necesarily true in another, after all.

[Snurfen]

No no no Miz, you must be wrong. How rude of you to presume you know more about something in your State than a bloke who lives on the other side of the world!
Oracle128 is always right and can never let an argument drop or back down gracefuly. :p

[Miz]

No no no Miz, you must be wrong. How rude of you to presume you know more about something in your State than a bloke who lives on the other side of the world!
Oracle128 is always right and can never let an argument drop or back down gracefuly. :p

Oh, geeze...you're right, of course. How presumptuous of me to think that years of reporting on local politics and local court cases and being friends with our county Magistrate Judge could possibly have taught me such details.

I must have had a psychotic episode. I'm much better now. :D

[ggross]

heh, yeah, well the thing is that they wanted proof that he was knowledgable of the constitutional rights, its amazing as to how many judges you can find that dont truely understand the consitutional rights and even more amazing as to how many abuse them that do know about them. and kinda off topic but why do we need a license to drive a vehical that WE purchased on a road that was bought with OUR money? I understand the whole point of safety and everything but the definition of a license is permission to do something that would otherwise be illegal. Now its legal to by a car. So why do we need a license to drive it? Not really looking for an answer cause I kinda know just a lil thought. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year and thank you DELTREE

[Vercades]

But, in this case its a presiding circuit judge they are questioning. It seems he that he would have to have been elected to his position according to the rules set forth by the state.
I think it's because of the circumstances, different judges handle different cases one judge can't be a universal judge to every situation brought to a court of law.


heh, yeah, well the thing is that they wanted proof that he was knowledgable of the constitutional rights, its amazing as to how many judges you can find that dont truely understand the consitutional rights and even more amazing as to how many abuse them that do know about them. and kinda off topic but why do we need a license to drive a vehical that WE purchased on a road that was bought with OUR money? I understand the whole point of safety and everything but the definition of a license is permission to do something that would otherwise be illegal. Now its legal to by a car. So why do we need a license to drive it? Not really looking for an answer cause I kinda know just a lil thought. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year and thank you DELTREE


Geez, man... have a little faith. You're making a couple unfounded claims... more on assumption it's a bad habit. Driving without a license? I can't see any remote logic to that at all. Merry xmas..lol

[Miz]

People questions judges' decisions all the time...it's called the appeals system. Don't like the decision, go to the next higher court on appeal. Keep doing that until you win, exhaust your options or run out of money...often, it's all three. Exhausting your options takes years, often decades. Running out of money usually happens more quickly.

People also question judges' competency. In states where judges are elected, they can be unelected. In states where judges are appointed, they can be impeached. Federal judges are a whole different deal, though.

As far as licensing goes...it's the method that state governments came up with to try to ensure that the drivers aiming their vehicles down the road have at least a minimum amount of ability to operate that lethal weapon. It doesn't have as much to do with controlling the oppressed masses as it does with trying to protect those masses from the idiots among them.

[Vercades]

Speculation should not rule a person's judgement.

Gavel! (http://65.24.128.15/sounds/televis/law_order/logavel.mp3)

[oracle128]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magistrate#State_judicial_systems
http://www.yorkcounty.gov/cwa/CJS_101/magistrate.htm
http://www.courts.state.va.us/mag/page1.htm

[Miz]

Kansas Judicial Branch website (http://www.kscourts.org/dstcts/), third paragraph, second sentence, "Some counties have district magistrate judges...."

The Federal Magistrate Judges Association (http://www.fedjudge.org/index.asp), self explanatory.

The word "magistrate" is defined: "an official entrusted with administration of the laws: as a : a principal official exercising governmental powers over a major political unit (as a nation) b : a local official exercising administrative and often judicial functions c : a local judiciary official having limited original jurisdiction especially in criminal cases"

The use of the word "judge" following the word "magistrate" is commonly...and, in Kansas, officially...used to denote precisely which of the above three definitions is referenced.

Now I realize there will be those among you who cannot accept, gracefully or otherwise, that Kansas and the Federal Magistrate Judges Association (as well as others, no doubt) have decided to use the word "judge" in conjunction with the word "magistrate." I feel your pain.

My hope is that those among you who display, through every word you use, every attitude you express, contempt for the vagaries of humans and their languages may someday be able to enter into social discourse without alienating each and every person with whom you interact.

[Snurfen]

Sorry Miz, what have I started? :rotflmao:

[oracle128]

Yes, I'm aware that Kansas has what are officially called "Magistrate Judges", despite the mutual exclusivity of those terms in every other capacity (ie. akin to calling an army officer a "Private General" -two very different terms for two very different jobs). But I was under the impression this issue was taking place in Virginia (where "magistrate judges" don't exist, like everywhere else except a few US states, where "magistrate" and "judge" are totally different jobs and jurisdictions)?
I know the whole story, I live with them.....but hey whatever.Location: Lynchburg Virginia
Edit: From what I can gather in the links you posted, the only "magistrate judges" are Federal judges (which I knew about from the Wikipedia article I linked), not state judges- like I originally thought, indicating that Kansas does not in fact have its own "magistrate judges" which is what you appear to suggest (rather, they'd have a Federally appointed district magistrate judge). Is Real Estate not predominantly under state jurisdiction in the US? Real Estate transaction law is governed mainly by Contract law, which in turn is governed primarily by state law; real estate ownership is governed by Real Property law, which in turn is governed wholly by the state. In fact, the only areas of real estate I can find that are governed primarily by Federal laws are a) where the Federal Fair Housing Act comes into play, and b) I'm assuming, where Native American land entitlements have to be taken into account. Probably military usage is covered somewhere as well. But I can't find anything regarding civil real estate being governed Federally (as in, involving a district magistrate judge).

[Snurfen]

Told ya!

[oracle128]

Told ya!Fine, have it your way. I'll leave it to you to inform all the magistrates they're out of a job, now that all 13 federal District Magistrate Judges for East and West Virginia are taking over the state's magistrate functions.

[Rainbow32]

All I know about judges is that they wear black robes, most of the time, and have the power to throw your ass in jail, which is why I try to avoid them at all costs.;)

[Miz]

To recap (for those who have lost their way):

My first post in this thread (#38) was to give a very basic, non-detailed overview of the U.S. judicial system as it pertains to judgeships since there seemed to be some confusion over that point.

Post #40 was in response to Snurfen's post concerning what sort of qualifications a person must have to occupy the various judgeships. I tossed the information in about Kansas as an example.

Kansas does, indeed, have state funded, elected, magistrate judges, one per county, each county electing its own, each candidate required to be a resident of the county in which he or she is elected.

My replies to you, oracle, were about your taking issue with paragraph three of my post (#40) which was confined solely, completely and exclusively about Kansas and included the fact Kansas has magistrate judges and calls them magistrate judges. That information about the Kansas system was included as an example of the sort of judicial system a state may have.

Perhaps the salient point being missed is that in the United States there are two separate and distinct judicial systems: Federal and State. Each state has whatever system it has set up within its state constitution. The states' systems are neither controlled nor paid for by the Federal government. The existence of the magistrate judges position in one system does not usurp nor prohibit the same designation in the other system.

The two overlap only when a case that has made its way through the state system is appealed to the federal system on the basis of a constitutional question. That question is usually not the original basis of the case (example: claiming that the foreclosure was in violation of Virgina state law) but, rather, that events violated the U.S. Constitution (perhaps claiming that due process was denied).

[Miz]

Told ya!

Yes, you did. I cannot claim I entered further into the morass of nitpicking and flogging petty issues to nubbins blind and without warning.

On the other hand, I taught high school for several years so I do have some experience with that mindset. :D

[oracle128]

What was the point of talking about Kansas' federal District Magistrate Judges then? Not only is this issue not in Kansas, but it's not a federal matter either. Was there a specific reason for talking off-topic, or did you just misunderstand the situation? Where you aware that you were in fact describing the job of a state Magistrate while you were referring to the District Magistrate Judges?

[Miz]

It was a part of my example of the different types of judicial systems each state may have. The job description is accurate. District Magistrate Judges, in Kansas, are elected in each county by the voters in that county. Their offices are funded partially by the state, partially by their counties. Their salaries are paid by the state, their office expenses, office space, courtrooms, etc. are paid for by their counties. So if you want to pick at another nit, you could say they are state district magistrate judges.

[ggross]

where I work and everything is lynchburg virginia I lived with them for a while in bedford county but came to lynchburg which is like 30 mins everday and was preparing to move to lynchburg so instead of posting bedford I just put lynchburg.

[ggross]

I think it's because of the circumstances, different judges handle different cases one judge can't be a universal judge to every situation brought to a court of law.



Geez, man... have a little faith. You're making a couple unfounded claims... more on assumption it's a bad habit. Driving without a license? I can't see any remote logic to that at all. Merry xmas..lol

yeah well like I said :-P lol its more of a thought im just kinda like thats a lil odd I mean im pretty sure that you didnt need a license to drive a car when they first came out but now I realize that a license is more of a record than anything else, I dont think it should be called a license and the fact that if you drive without it then its like you are trying to hide something from them which cops can still find your info without your license but the license makes everything smoother and quicker and easier and I mean we all carry around some kind of wallet or purse so its not like its hurting us.

[oink]

http://www.bedfordbulletin.com/articles/2006/12/22/news/news07.txt

[oracle128]

http://www.bedfordbulletin.com/articles/2006/12/22/news/news07.txtThe missing piece of the puzzle?
Those included comments on the sale of the property by Clum stating "You may have bought it but you'll never live in it,"

[Vercades]

http://www.bedfordbulletin.com/articles/2006/12/22/news/news07.txt
Yeah, the constitution nowadays is equivalent to toilet paper. :rotflmao:

[z1p]

Yeah, the constitution nowadays is equivalent to toilet paper. :rotflmao:
Excuse Me... But, what the heck does the constitution have to do with someone failing to pay a debt owed and having their collateral taken. The Constitution does not negate anyone's personal responsibility.

[Vercades]

Ok I'll level with you I got no clue what's going on with this, I'm a complete idiot. :)

[ggross]

ok yeah, so not only did they watch them take it to the storage facilities but they also followed me to MY FRIENDS APARTMENT AND PARKED IN HANDICAP SPOTS while I dropped him off and went inside we took pictures of the 2 SUV's that followed us. "Hoy said the family left the 85-acre property, located at 1494 Magnolia Dr., without a confrontation. Tactical units from the sheriff's office and state police were on hand along with four canine units, the state police bomb squad and two state police helicopters. Following the eviction the tactical units scoured the home looking for anything that could have been dangerous that had been left behind. In all more than 40 officers were on hand." you see, now you know that im not making this stuff up, course I didnt know they had the bomb squad or the canine units. WHATS WITH ALL THE COPS. Mr. Clum said SEVERAL times that he would never resort to violence to solve matters at hand.

[ggross]

Excuse Me... But, what the heck does the constitution have to do with someone failing to pay a debt owed and having their collateral taken. The Constitution does not negate anyone's personal responsibility.
Maybe the fact that it was all illegal?

[oracle128]

Maybe the fact that it was all illegal?Which part? The part where he was evicted from a property he no longer owns and vehemently refused to leave, deliberately sabotaging the sale of said property? Or the part where he was escorted by a few dozen armed police, because of his threatening comments and "survivalist" (read: "armed nutjob") nature?

[ggross]

what the deal with the father putting his daughters into these situations. Why would he have his daughters of all people there on the day of the eviction.
oh and the girls volunteered for this, but its not like they cant handle it they are always competing in national karate tournaments and are 2nd degree blackbelts. They arent what I would call lil girls.

[dclum]

The Truth is nowhere to be found, and whoever shuns evil becomes prey.
The LORD looked and was displeased that there was no justice.
He saw that there was no one, He was appalled that there was no one to intervene;
so His own arm worked salvation for him, and His own righteousness sustained Him. Isaiah 59:15-16


The Clum Family was attacked in December 2006 in Bedford County, Virginia by unconstitutional judges Harold A. Black, James W. Updike, Jr., the Bedford County Sheriff, Mike Brown and the Governor of Virginia, Tim Kaine, who failed to perform his ministerial duty… all at the insistence of BB&T Bank, the culprit who began this travesty.

(By the way… the judges are constitutionally unqualified because they failed to provide Clum with a copy of their Oath of Office, a copy of their Surety Bond and the name of the company that backs that Bond with Constitutional Article I, Section 10, Clause 1 gold and silver, as required of them by lawfully presented Subpoena Duces Tecum. You see, we have a Right to qualify those who would sit in judgment of us.)

Here’s how it all began…. It was after David-Earle: Clum read; “The Creature from Jekyll Island” by G. Edward Griffin, www.realityzone.com (http://www.realityzone.com)

Clum began a journey into the TRUTH of the central banking system in America. He learned that national banks DO NOT LOAN ANYTHING in a traditional promissory note transaction. In fact, they are prohibited by law from doing so:

“When banks place credits into your checking account, they are merely pretending to lend you money. In reality, they have nothing to lend.” Chapter 10, The Mandrake Mechanism, The Creature from Jekyll Island-A Second Look at the Federal Reserve, G. Edward Griffin, ISBN 0-912986-39-5.

“Of course, they do not really pay out loans from the money they receive as deposits. If they did this, no additional money would be created. What they do when they make loans is to accept promissory notes in exchange for credits to the borrowers' transaction accounts. Loans (assets) and deposits (liabilities) both rise by $9,000. Reserves are unchanged by the loan transactions.” Modern Money Mechanics - A Workbook on Bank Reserves and Deposit Expansion, Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago, Dorothy M. Nichols, 1961, Rev February 1994.

“Banks actually create money when they lend it. Here's how it works: Most of a bank's loans are made to its own customers and are deposited in their checking accounts. Because the loan becomes a new deposit, just like a paycheck does, the bank once again holds a small percentage of that new amount in reserve and again lends the remainder to someone else, repeating the money-creation process many times.” Money, Banking and Monetary Policy – Everyday Economics, Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago.

"In the federal courts, it is well settled that a national bank has not power to lend its credit to another by becoming surety, endorser, or guarantor for him". Farmers and Miners Bank v. Bluefield Nat'l Bank 11F 2d 83, 271 U.S. 669

"A national bank cannot lend its credit to another by becoming surety, endorser, or guarantor for him, such an act being ultra vires.." Merchants' Bank v. Baird 160 F. 642
"Banking Associations from the very nature of their business are prohibited from lending credit." (St. Louis Savings Bank vs. Parmalee 95 U. S. 557)
"A bank can lend its money but not its credit." (First National Bank of Tallapoosa vs. Monroe, 135 Ga 614, 69 SE 1123, 32 LRA)
"A national bank, under federal law being limited in its powers and capacity, cannot lend its credit." (Howard & Foster Co. vs. Citizens National Bank of Union, 133 SC 202, 130 SE 758)
"Banking corporations cannot lend credit." (First National Bank of Amarillo vs. Slaton Independent School District, Tex Civ App 1933, 58 SW 2d 870)
"There is no doubt but what the law is that a national bank cannot lend its credit or become an accommodation endorser." (National Bank of Commerce vs. Atkinson, 55 Fed Rep 465)
"Nowhere is the express authority granted to the corporation to lend its credit." (Gardilner Trust vs. Augusta Trust, 134 Me 191; 291 US 245)
This is just a sampling of the volumes of case law that prove banks create money out of thin air, stealing promissory notes, and calling it a “loan”.

What the banks do is take your promissory note and “monetize” it. They flip it over and stamp it as a deposit… just like a check… into a transaction account in your name without telling you and then give you the money they created out of thin air, “loaning” you nothing, and then claim that you owe them!

Where the Clum’s come from that’s called fraud, piracy, counterfeiting, and its “legal” under the de facto government’s Federal Reserve System, which is nothing more than an international banking cartel, created to steal the wealth from every American. Read the book….!!!

Clum has always believed that whoever funds a loan should be repaid. So…when he learned that the bank defrauded him and stole his promissory note under the terms of an unlawful $150,000 “line of credit”, on a property valued at over $1.5 Million, he decided to take action.

When he looked at his Deed of Trust document on file with Bedford County, Virginia he learned that it was only he and his wife that signed as the Grantor on the document. No one from the bank could sign it or they would be committing Securities fraud… see the law above.

So, since the Grantor (he and his wife) were the only ones to sign the document… they were the only ones with the lawful Right to modify it. And so they did.

They fired BB&T as beneficiary and trustee… lawfully naming themselves to those positions. This document is on file in Bedford County as Instrument Number 060007652 dated May 19, 2006.

Using House Joint Resolution 192 of June 5, 1933 as well as the Uniform Commercial Code and the Code of Virginia as their guide, they issued Bond # RE095451612US on February 15, 2006 in an amount to more than cover the fraudulent note and when the bank failed to respond to the lawfully presented Bond, the Clum’s recorded the bank’s default at Instrument Number 060005547 on May 24, 2006 in Shenandoah County, Virginia.

As lawful Beneficiary and Trustee they were the only ones with the Right to
“foreclose” should that be necessary.

BB&T, through its lackey attorneys in Norfolk, Virginia, Glasser and Glasser, PLC, headed by Michael A. Glasser and ramroded by Richard A. Knee and Melvin R. Zimm, ignored the Bond and have never returned it. Instead they chose to “sell” the property at a “foreclosure” on August 29, 2006. Watch tape 1 – 4 below.

The bank’s lackey, Eric Spain, who claimed to buy the property at foreclosure, had his attorney, G. Edgar Dawson of Lynchburg, VA file an “Unlawful Detainer” action against the Clums which the unconstitutional General District Court judge, Harold A. Black, granted.

Color of title without possession is insufficient to sustain an action of unlawful detainer” Hot Springs Mfg Co v Sterret, 1908, 62 SE 797, 108 Va. 710

Clum appealed, posting a $15,000.00 cash bond, and the case moved to Circuit Court and unconstitutional judge James W. Updike, Jr.’s office. A trial was set for December 11 and pre-trial hearing for December 6th. More about these in a moment…

The Clums also learned about land patents and allodial title.

We the People in America fought this war thing, called a “Revolution”, back in the 1700’s in order to be able to live under a system of government free from the oppression of the king and his feudal system of land ownership. And we wanted to be free from the taxation system of the king’s central bankers in Europe.

We won the war thing and kicked the king off the continent. Hoorah!!!

People of a state are entitled to all rights which formerly belonged to the king by his prerogative Lansing v. Smith (1829) 4 Wend. 9, 20

For awhile things went well. A man could own his land in allodium (http://www.answers.com/topic/allodial-title ) and not have to worry about the government taxing him off of it or regulating how many houses he could build or what kind of trees he could plant.

Then came this other war thing called the “Civil War”. We the People lost that one and “Honest Abe” lied to everyone about the reconstruction. Instead of freeing the slaves… he made slaves of us all. Visit L. B. Bork’s website: www.pacinlaw.org (http://www.pacinlaw.org) and read about the 14th Amendment.

On October 2, 2006, the Clums posted and published their claim of ownership of the property.

“A description which will identify the lands (and possession) is all that is necessary for the validity of the patent”, Lossing v. Shull, 173 S.W.2d 1, 1 Mo. 342 (1943)

On December 2, 2006 that claim was perfected according to Title 43 of the United States Code and the Clums sent the notice of the patent to the Governor for his signature.

“When it is determined that the entryman or purchaser has done all that is required of him and that the land is subject to entry or sale, the issuance of a patent is a mere ministerial act, even though the ascertainment of the existence of the necessary prerequisites requires an administrative determination.” La Terre Co. v. Billiot's Shell Island, 103 F.2d 53 (C.C.A. 5th Cir. 1939)

The governor failed to issue the patent as required of him.

On Wednesday, December 6th, Clum went into the pre-trial hearing on the unlawful “Unlawful Detainer” action against him and unconstitutional judge Updike gave Spain’s attorneys and BB&T’s attorneys everything they wanted… granting them the ability to quash all of the evidence, and thereby withholding all of the truth, that should be presented to a jury.

When Clum demanded a Common Law adjudication of the matter and after he read Supreme Court case after Supreme Court case into the record, noticing the “judge” that since he was constitutionally unqualified to adjudicate the matter he would lose judicial immunity for any adverse rulings against Clum and that he would be personally liable, Updike held Clum in “contempt” and threw him into “jail” for “3 days”.

The claim and exercise of a constitutional right cannot be converted into a crime. Miller v. U.S. 230 F 486,489

The judge held Clum 4 days because Clum refused to give the jailers his fingerprints, photograph and would not sign any papers or answer any questions. Clum says the fingerprints are not his to give as he did not create them. A “man” named Jesus the Christ created them and Clum didn’t have permission to give them away. Besides, they might use them against him somehow in violation of Clum’s 4th and 5th Amendment Rights.

On Friday, December 8th, while Clum was in jail, Updike sent the Sheriff to unlawfully allow Spain to inspect the property and was beaten back by Dave Albin and the Clum and Albin families. The Sheriff’s lackeys left because they knew that Updike was not constitutionally qualified and they did not want to be held personally liable for a trespass against Clum. Watch the video….

When Clum was released he had only hours to prepare for a trial on December 11th. But instead of going into a kangaroo court that was designed to defeat his defense, Clum noticed the judge of his unconstitutional actions and left the room.

A few hours later, the judge ordered the Sheriff to unlawfully enter Clum’s property and serve an unlawful “eviction notice” to Clum by way of 4 armed men, one with an assault rifle. Watch the video…

On December 12, 2006, the Clum family drove to Virginia’s capitol in Richmond and spoke face to face with the Governor’s lackeys, asking them to have the Governor grant a stay of execution on the “eviction notice” until such time as the United States Supreme Court could hear the matter.

The Governor informed the Clums that he would not perform his ministerial duty and issue the land patent and “is not” going to intervene to stave off the unlawful “eviction”.

On December 13th, the State Police circled the Clum property at low altitude with a helicopter to intimidate them.

At 1:05 pm, Thursday, December 14, 2006, the Governor sent his team to force the unarmed Clum and his 2 daughters off the property and in the process, confiscated the daughter’s video cameras as “evidence”.

As Clum and his Daughters, Hannah, 15 and Rachel, 13 walked hand-in-hand off the property, Hannah was assaulted 2 times by a female “law enforcement” thug who ran Dave Albin off the neighbor’s property a few minutes earlier.

Watch the videos of the property being posted, the sheriff cutting the lock off the gate and Dave Albin being run off the neighbor’s property by this lying female lackey of the “agencies” involved.

Then watch the December 15th video of Clum who, from the safety of his neighbor’s property, watched as the trucks hauled off his stolen property which his family had to leave behind and is now being held hostage by Knight Moving and Storage in Forest, Virginia.

Then read the Bedford Bulletin article below… http://www.bedfordbulletin.com/articles/2006/12/22/news/news07.txt

The action of the Governor was a blatant violation of his Oath of Office to support the Clums constitutional Rights. Some would say it was perjury of his oath and an act of Treason against the People of the State of Virginia and We the People of the United States.

It appears that a man cannot own property in this country. At least that is what the Governor told the Clums by his discretionary action to not issue the land patent or to intervene on the Clum’s behalf against the unlawful and unconstitutional actions of corrupt judges and law enforcement in Bedford County.

The issue of whether a man can or cannot own property in this land, as the constitution secures the Right to and as the forefathers fought for the Right to, must be decided, even if only by the US Supreme Court.

Time will tell. The Clums are not done fighting.

Watch Aaron Russo’s “America: From Freedom to Fascism” www.freedomtofascism.com (http://www.freedomtofascism.com)

This is the international banking system at work in Bedford County, Virginia, 2006, the birth place of a new nation.

A new nation… indeed.

Watch the videos… (please excuse some of the shaky videography, the children were a little nervous with armed men in their faces and walking onto their property)…then ask yourself…is this what we want for our children’s children??

Ex 34:7 Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear [the guilty]; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth [generation]. (AV)

2Ki 17:41 So these nations feared the LORD, and served their graven images, both their children, and their children's children: as did their fathers, so do they unto this day. (AV)

Pr 13:22 A good [man] leaveth an inheritance to his children's children: and the wealth of the sinner [is] laid up for the just. (AV)


Here are the www.youtube.com (http://www.youtube.com) videos in order of occurrence:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enanR8vZc0M – August 29, 2006 - Rachel’s cam pt 1 – Fraudulent foreclosure – Bedford County Courthouse – egregious constitutional violations against Clum and his daughters including assault with a deadly weapon against his daughters

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDmxS0TROt8 - August 29, 2006 - Rachel’s cam pt 2 - Fraudulent foreclosure – Bedford County Courthouse – egregious constitutional violations against Clum and his daughters including assault with a deadly weapon against his daughters

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvohCHMva5Q] - August 29, 2006 - Hannah’s cam pt 1 - Fraudulent foreclosure – Bedford County Courthouse – egregious constitutional violations against Clum and his daughters including assault with a deadly weapon against his daughters

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExD_oazOQhM – August 29, 2006 - Hannah’s cam pt 2 - Fraudulent foreclosure – Bedford County Courthouse – egregious constitutional violations against Clum and his daughters including assault with a deadly weapon against his daughters

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48fawW3O3FQ - December 8, 2006 - Defending the property from unlawful “inspection” – Albin and Clum families

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWJV560N9mo - December 11, 2006 - Assault to deliver unlawful “eviction notice” – 4 armed men, 1 with assault rifle

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XorLbLUJ9B8 - December 14, 2006 - Day of Eviction - Posting property and Sheriff bolt-cutting entry gate lock, helicopters and friend Albin unlawfully being chased off neighbors property by female sheriff or Fed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAKY1Py2QZo - December 15, 2006 pt 1 - Trucks loading stolen property – view from neighbor’s property

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1eZJzWmsQk - December 15, 2006 pt 2 - Clum explaining events from neighbor’s property

Governor Tim Kaine
http://www.governor.virginia.gov/AboutTheGovernor/contactGovernor.cfm
Numbers:
Phone: (804) 786-2211
Fax: (804) 371-6351

BB&T BANK Main Switchboard (1-800-226-5228)
http://www.bbt.com/bbt/about/companyinformation/executivemanagement.asp

JOHN A. ALLISON, IV Printable Version

John A. Allison
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
BB&T Corporation

JAMES W. UPDIKE, JR
BEDFORD COUNTY CIRCUIT COURT
540.586.7632
NO PICTURE AVAILABLE

BEDFORD COUNTY SHERIFF MIKE BROWN
Administrative offices open M-F, 8am to 4:30 pm
Main Phone Number: 540 - 586 - 4800
Fax Number: 540 - 586 - 9100
24 Hour Non-Emergency: 540 - 586 - 7827

[oracle128]

You see, we have a Right to qualify those who would sit in judgment of us.No, you don't. That's what Chief circuit court judges are for.
“When banks place credits into your checking account, they are merely pretending to lend you money. In reality, they have nothing to lend.” Chapter 10, The Mandrake Mechanism, The Creature from Jekyll Island-A Second Look at the Federal Reserve, G. Edward Griffin, ISBN 0-912986-39-5.This is false. Banks lend you electronic money. Electronic money is as good as physical note and coin.
http://austlii.edu.au/~alan/svc-legal.html

The rest of your post is the same crap - the "money" isn't real because the banks "never really owned it", which of course is the total fantasy of an insane conspiracy theorist. Hey, did you pay off the house in the first place entirely with cold hard cash? Ever owned any stocks, bonds or commodities? Oops, you can't, because they don't really exist. I guess now you're going to tell us your entire country's commerce system "doesn't really exist".

It appears that a man cannot own property in this country.Yep, that's correct. It's called Capitalism. Heard of it?

You want to learn about your rights? Put down those stupid, biased books written by morons with the same stupid agenda you have, and learn the real law. Or if you're incapable of doing that, seek the advice of a lawyer(s). Whatever you choose, get your facts straight, Clum. Nobody cares about you. You base your idiot ramblings off several works of fiction (including the most fictitious of all publications, the Bible). You're more than happy to abuse your Second Amendment rights to their fullest, yet when the very same system means you can't live on a property that you can no longer afford, you start crying about it. You've already shown yourself to be a nut job survivalist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivalist#Extremist_groups), and an anti-government conspiracy theorist. Now you're going to be one of those anti-Capitalist "I own this property and I'll make my own laws!" whackos. Congratulations, three strikes for you. I hope you get a nice, long jail term.

"Oh, but they had big, powerful guns and they took OUR property!" you scream. Oh boo hoo. You want to know why there were several armed police to escort you off the property you were illegally residing at? Because of people like you in situations like this (http://www.adl.org/learn/safety/deadly_domains.asp), that's why. Be grateful no shots were fired and nothing was damaged. Heaven knows I wouldn't have hesitated pull the trigger if you so much as looked at me funny. You're a disgrace to humanity, and it's people like you that give your country a bad name.

[dclum]

It appears oracle128 is choosing to live in Adamic dreamland. I pray someday YAHVEH wakes you.

[ggross]

No, you don't. That's what Chief circuit court judges are for.
This is false. Banks lend you electronic money. Electronic money is as good as physical note and coin.
http://austlii.edu.au/~alan/svc-legal.html

The rest of your post is the same crap - the "money" isn't real because the banks "never really owned it", which of course is the total fantasy of an insane conspiracy theorist. Hey, did you pay off the house in the first place entirely with cold hard cash? Ever owned any stocks, bonds or commodities? Oops, you can't, because they don't really exist. I guess now you're going to tell us your entire country's commerce system "doesn't really exist".

Yep, that's correct. It's called Capitalism. Heard of it?

You want to learn about your rights? Put down those stupid, biased books written by morons with the same stupid agenda you have, and learn the real law. Or if you're incapable of doing that, seek the advice of a lawyer(s). Whatever you choose, get your facts straight, Clum. Nobody cares about you. You base your idiot ramblings off several works of fiction (including the most fictitious of all publications, the Bible). You're more than happy to abuse your Second Amendment rights to their fullest, yet when the very same system means you can't live on a property that you can no longer afford, you start crying about it. You've already shown yourself to be a nut job survivalist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivalist#Extremist_groups), and an anti-government conspiracy theorist. Now you're going to be one of those anti-Capitalist "I own this property and I'll make my own laws!" whackos. Congratulations, three strikes for you. I hope you get a nice, long jail term.

"Oh, but they had big, powerful guns and they took OUR property!" you scream. Oh boo hoo. You want to know why there were several armed police to escort you off the property you were illegally residing at? Because of people like you in situations like this (http://www.adl.org/learn/safety/deadly_domains.asp), that's why. Be grateful no shots were fired and nothing was damaged. Heaven knows I wouldn't have hesitated pull the trigger if you so much as looked at me funny. You're a disgrace to humanity, and it's people like you that give your country a bad name.

PPSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSST ORACLE the definition for human is a monster! SO YOU COMPLIMENTED HIM good one.... sry just had to point that out but yeah he can explain everything so much better than I can dont know if he should waste his time though cause hes a busy busy guy, who knows.

[oracle128]

It appears oracle128 is choosing to live in Adamic dreamland. I pray someday YAHVEH wakes you.Oh my, it always has to be about "God" with you people, doesn't it? If only your imaginary friend had granted you enough cash to pay your debts, you wouldn't be in this mess!
PPSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSST ORACLE the definition for human is a monster! SO YOU COMPLIMENTED HIM good one....What language are you speaking? (http://www.google.com.au/search?q=define%3Ahuma)
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=define%3AhumaThen why doesn't "he" just get straight to the point and explain which parts of the law are clearly on his side, rather than quoting pseudo-legals from a biased "book" with an obvious agenda?

[ggross]

(including the most fictitious of all publications, the Bible
wow.....u r honostly in my prayers brother, ight well Im not here to discuss any of this no more im here to discuss puters. And seeing as God created us and blesses us and sent his son to DIE for us then YES it DOES have to be about God and if more people would realize that then we might possibly be in a better world? but like said im not here to discuss all that. I dont want anyone mad at me over what has been done and taken place, I enjoy these threads and learning more about troubleshooting and computers. Dont really want people against me here.